Anyone as excited about MV12 as we are?

[rachel]

For those who haven't heard yet, MV12 is going to start shipping on February 27, just a few short days away.

Aside from a more compact form factor, here are some of the hardware headliners:

• Advanced mobile-grade processor, which enables computer vision and machine learning
• 802.11ac wireless capable (functionality coming Fall 2018)
• 128GB and 256GB integrated storage options
• Narrow and wide field of view options (MV12 is a fixed lens camera)
• Integrated microphone

MV12 uses the same architecture as the first generation of MV, with video stored on the camera itself, not on a server or in the cloud. This means all the architectural benefits that came with the first generation (minimal bandwidth usage of about 50kbps while the camera is not being viewed remotely, cameras continue recording even if network connection goes down, etc.) are available on MV12 as well.

What exactly are computer vision and machine learning anyway? Computer vision simply refers to the idea that MV12 is able to understand images as more than just pixels. At launch, MV12 features person detection -- the ability to determine if something is a person, or not a person. And, with machine learning, these cameras will get smarter and more accurate over time.

The most exciting thing is the abundance of possibilities this functionality opens for the cameras. We hope to provide rich business insights to users in addition to providing a great security camera experience. Just like Location Analytics simply adds to an already-great MR wireless experience, advanced analytics on MV12 will open new possibilities to users: think people counting and more!

We're excited to get these into your hands to see how people use them. Anybody else as excited as we are? Let us know some of the problems you face that you think can be solved with MV12!

[Adam]

I definitely am.  We have been chomping at the bit to get cameras with audio.  We have been using Nest cameras in the interim for areas where we need audio.  I have orders pending and ready as soon they are available.

So far as I can tell here is a little cheat sheet on the MV12 models since there isn't a compare yet.

12N - Narrow - 73° horizontal field of view (FOV), 256GB

12W - Wide - 114° horizontal field of view (FOV), 256GB

12WE - Wide Entry -  114° horizontal field of view (FOV), 128GB

[DanStewart]

Question on the note about Wireless 802.11ac future capability.

Does this mean that no wireless is available at launch?
Or that 802.11ac only is not available until fall 2018?

[MRCUR]

@DanStewart No wireless functionality is available at launch (I suspect the firmware to support it isn't complete). 

[DanStewart]

Thanks MRCUR!
This information was confirmed in the Meraki MV focused webinar today (2/27)

[rachel]

Hi @DanStewart,

Wireless as a feature will not be available until Fall 2018, when we will "flip the switch" on the software side. Hope that helps!

-RL

[nikiwaibel]

@rachel: any chance, this wireless feature is also merged into MR / Z1 / Z3 / MX64W / MX65W series?

it would be (VERY!) nice to connect those devices DIRECTLY in wlan-station mode to the internet.

[nikiwaibel]

@rachel: will the MV12 be able connect to "any" WLAN (also non-Meraki - maybe with some restrictions at the beginning in case there is a splash page); or will the WiFi connectivity work only within a meraki-WLAN (MRxx, maybe MXyyW)?

[Adam]

Got my MV12's in.  I hope to have them installed this week and will provide more feedback on the audio capabilities etc...

We were using Nest cameras as a comparison for the areas that needed audio. 

[Adam]

Some product pics

And here is a pic next to a MV21 for size comparison

[MRCUR]

@Adam They are SUPER small compared to the 21's! I was really surprised when I unboxed them yesterday. 

Some quick observations:

• The status LED is now multicolored like MR/MS/MX devices. 
• There's no more autofocus in Dashboard (MV 3.4 firmware) - the cameras appear to do this automatically.
• The cameras can do HDR if enabled!
• Image quality is definitely improved over MV21/71 (I've been using 1080p enhanced mode which is 3138Kbps@20fps).
• Export file sizes are significantly larger when using 1080p obviously - something to keep in mind for MV12 deployments!
• T-rail mounts are NOT included for drop ceilings.
• Person detection is awesome. Works surprisingly well, even with multiple people in the frame.  

[rachel]

@MRCUR @Adam Thanks for the updates and photos! We're excited to hear how your experiences with the cameras go!

[rachel]

@nikiwaibel When we turn the wireless on on the software side, it will be compatible with non-Meraki WLAN as well as Meraki 🙂

[PacketHauler]

We're looking to possibly roll out Meraki cameras to all of our pharmacies in the near future. We have ordered a couple of these for trial to make sure they will provide the views we need. We already have a few MV21s deployed. These new cameras appear to have a much lower profile and better capture resolution. We're excited to see how they perform!

[Adam]

Got three of the MV12W's ordered today.  I'll post back here when I have them installed to provide feedback compared to the many MV21's we have implemented.  I know the MV12's don't have optical zoom like the MV21's do but we don't really use that feature anyway.  

[DanStewart]

Adam, Great catch about the lack of optical zoom on the MV12 vs. the MV21/71.

Looking forward to your feedback

Kudos!

[Wibster73]

First let me say, I think the MV12 will be a great addition.  Are there plans to have an Outside Camera cable of wireless?

[Adam]

My guess is it will become the MV17 😉

[rachel]

Anything is possible, we always say...

[nikiwaibel]

hi @rachel! thank you for asking!

i hope, that the cams are able to go beyond person recognition, ie:

* cam looks at a conveyor belt and learns regular operation (belt moves and transport of items happens every couple of sec).

--> as soon as an item is missing, or a wrong item is detected, an alarm is generated (depending on a schedule).

--> as soon as the conveyor belt stops or runs too fast, an alarm goes off.

* the mic could be used in the same way!!! the machine-learning algorithms learn the "default" noise. as soon as that noise changes, an alarm goes off (depending on a schedule).

it MUST be possible to turn the mic off, to apply to the general data protection regulation (GDPR) more easily.

[rachel]

@nikiwaibel thanks for the feedback and suggestions! Needless to say we're excited about all the possibilities this new platform/processor are opening for us to develop.

As for the microphone--great catch!--and this is exactly why it comes "off" by default.

[PacketHauler]

I just received my trial cameras via FedEx today. I can't believe how small they are! This makes me extremely excited to try them out. We will be deploying a couple of hundred across our company. Being an infusion pharmacy company, this will help keep our pharmacies and drug storage in compliance. (Pen in picture is for scale)

[Adam]

Here is an example screenshot with the High dynamic range feature turned off (top) and on (bottom) with the MV12.

I've also noticed the audio on these is quite good.  Better than the Nest cameras we were using. 

[GeorgeB]

[DanStewart]

Nice pic of the camera doing it's thing!

Any thoughts of a Smoked Dome cover for the MV series cameras?

This a frequent request from our customers, and an option available from most Physical Security vendors.

It would add a degree of covert monitoring to not know where the camera is specifically pointing.

We have an order placed for a few MV12s, looking forward to the experience first hand.

[GeorgeB]

We investigated smoked domes but decided not to offer one after customer interviews and testing of prototype domes. Even a lightly smoked dome cuts light transmission drastically and correspondingly decreases image quality due to the need for higher gain or slower shutter speed. To really prevent people seeing where the camera is pointing you need a heavily smoked dome.

We did not speak to any customers where the smoked dome was mandatory, more of a nice to have. We also spoke to customers that said it doesn't make a difference as people worked out where the cameras were pointing any way.

Should we get more demand for this we can revisit it's availability as an accessory.

[DanStewart]

Great information!

Thank you for the insight. I will relay this feedback to my team.

[MRCUR]

I'm still blown away by how small the MV12's are compared to the MV21. This is also a good size comparison to a traditional camera that we're replacing. 

[lfischer-gcpl]

Any ideas for when MV12 trials will ship out? Ours has been on back order for a long while now.

[Roska]

@lfischer-gcpl if you´re in Europe there seems to be some stock allocation on MV12 models.

[Roska]

Got a MV12N order delivered this week.

[TimHughSmith]

Hey guys,

Looks like the MV21/71 mounts are not compatible with the MV12

And there is basically only a wall mount or ceiling mount plate included.

I'd like to get some arms to get them off the walls a little bit in this deployment.

I'm also curious about what this means for the MV21

It has a 5MP processor right, but only does 720p

It was nice and flexible to have the 3-10 vari focal lens in there.

The FOV is also pretty wide - even on the N. Looking at some traditional CCTV units that have an option to flip the 16:9 round, so you can shoot it down a corridor. This seems like a nice feature.

But I digress.

Mounting options anyone? 🙂

Cheers,

Tim

[DanStewart]

Extending this feedback.

We would like to see T-Rail mounts be included, or an accessory for these MV12 cameras for drop ceiling installs.

These are gaining traction with our partners and has been an ask many as they are familiar with the original MV21 included this mounting option.

This was also noted prior in this thread from the review by @MRCUR.

[GeorgeB]

The MV12 is too small for the t-rail kit to fit the default mounting plate. The MV12 is also too small to fit a standard 4x4 junction box. As the camera is not very heavy it can be directly attached to the ceiling tile, but I know this is not ideal. We are working on a mounting kit which will allow for t-rail mounting along with junction box mounting. I hope this will be released in the coming months.

[DanStewart]

Thank you @GeorgeB

Great information. This helps us out.

Looking forward to the future product updates.

[MRCUR]

@DanStewart Update to my earlier comment about lack of t-rail mounts: we successfully deployed well over 200 MV12’s that are mounted directly to ceiling tiles. We used the included drywall mounting screws that come with the cameras. We originally were very concerned about this but now having gone through the deployment it’s a non-issue. 

We also mounted to 4x4 boxes by using a blank cover plate and screwing the mount onto the plate. Worked fine for the cameras that were wall mounted and it looks very clean. 

We’ll be interested to see what @GeorgeB & team come up with as official solutions. 

[DanStewart]

@MRCUR Real world deployment examples are extremely beneficial to us on the Pre-Sales side. Glad to hear these worked out for you in a large deployment. Thanks for the insight 

[GeorgeB]

Have you tested out the sensor crop feature on the MV12?

https://documentation.meraki.com/MV/Other_Topics/MV_Sensor_Crop

[TimHughSmith]

Hi @GeorgeB - I hadn't seen the sensor crop feature. This looks good, I'll try it out!

Is there any information on what that would translate to from a traditional CCTV identification requirement?

i.e. identification possible from X to Y meters?

[ITManaged247]

Hi

We have just started using the MV12 for a sole reason to count people. Unfortunately, at the moment counting isn't at its best and we are getting some extraordinary numbers in our store. We know our store can attract up to 2000 people but with this camera, the number can go up to 38000! 

Are we doing something wrong?

Your feedback is appreciated

P.S. Camera was pointing to cover the shop window which means catching the people walking on the street. However, We have changed the position to cover only inside the shop but even though the numbers are still very hight!

[HenningPedersen]

How do you plan to power the MV12 when using WiFi?

[Adam]

---

@HenningPedersen wrote:

How do you plan to power the MV12 when using WiFi?

---

I'd be interested in knowing this as well but I assume it is similar to Nest and Ring devices that require 110 power. Which, for me, it is easier to get an ethernet with POE to the device rather than 110 in most cases. 

[Ben]

@HenningPedersen @Adam 

see the latest blog post here.

A new accessory for MV12 makes recabling analog camera deployments a thing of the past

https://meraki.cisco.com/blog/2018/08/look-ma-no-wires/

This goes hand in hand with the WiFi ability of the MV. I'm pretty sure if you have a PoE adapter that's powerfull enough you could power your Camera like this with only the PoE side enabled and plugged into a nearby socket.

[Adam]

Agreed but the whole wireless camera thing has always been kind of funny to me.  If you can pull power to the camera (with or without some kind of adapter) then why not just pull a POE ethernet cable instead and get reliable power/data all in one shot?  But I guess it may make sense for some folks with legacy equipment. 

[Twiles]

I see it as more of an issue with distance from a switch. Wireless can extend your reach to an area that is over 100m and has power readily available (not different than an AP in mesh mode).